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TG = Terry Goddard
SG = Sam Goddard
TG (T. Goddard): State Chairman in '60.
SG (S. Goddard): Yeah. And, uh, (laughs) I remember I had an assistant that we were driving; we had to do a hell of a lot of driving in those days and uh my assistant was with me and we were trying to figure out something to do about these wide open problems and I looked at him and I said, 'Ben, I've got to run for office because there's no other way we can get things changed.' So I did. Then I tried to change too many things, anduh, they really came out after me on bonding. Because we could get bonds for three and a half percent at that time. And raise the moneyto build all the state institutions and we had a lot of them that needed building right then, including, if you go down to the State Capitol -- the big buildings on both sides -- they were financed out of Texas and we could have financed them for three percent money. I mean the whole thing is sad.